Re: Second request

I must have overlooked the first request.

 

For years I have suggested that, especially for church prayers but no reason not to for private prayers, we stop and think about what specifically we are asking God to do and then look at the Bible for support for such a request.

 

We pray for God to touch the heart of an unbeliever. We are asking God to operate outside the foolishness of preaching to cause someone to believe. That is not a biblical concept so that prayer is a waste of breath. If we want that person saved TEACH THEM ourselves. Anyone who says they cannot tell others about Jesus is a liar and just plain lazy. Similar to when a person sees another person entering a dangerous situation and turns their back because they do not want to get involved.

 

But to your question: I, personally, me do not expect God to do anything for me. For years I did but no longer. I have never experienced nor have I observed the answer to any prayer for any reason. I have listened to church members ask for safety and protection, blessings (whatever they are), health and healing, to give the preacher a ready recollection, my personal favorite, "we pray for. . ." and on and on. I have never heard anyone ever pray for strength and boldness to tell others about Jesus.  

 

While "God helps those who help themselves" is not in the Bible I do not believe God is going to do anything for me I can do for myself. I believe God has already provided the way of escape from temptations so I do not expect anything special there either so there is no reason to pray about that.

 

This is an area each has to decide for themselves what they believe and why they believe it. Realizing the fact they believing something does not make it correct. As for me I have come to conclusions for myself. I felt a bit alone at first but I do not anymore. I think myself foolish before for thinking God would do something for me while he would sit or stand by and let a child be beaten to death, starve to death, die of a hideous disease.  I do not read anywhere in the bible of people praying for things we pray for today so I must accept they are not biblical.

 

I am sure I have not answered your question but Jesus never answered questions either. He just asked other questions so I guess that makes me Christ like.

 

Ps The moron who is having a Burn a Koran Day has admitted he is praying about it. Even a moron knows God does not burn Korans and does not want his people to do it either. God's kingdom is not of this world. So what is the moron praying about?

 

 

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com 
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

"IF 7UP hadn't decided on a name that was short and sweet we'd still be drinking Bib-Label Lithiated Lemon-Lime Soda."

On Wed, Sep 8, 2010 at 6:48 AM, Jake Book <jbook40@yahoo.com> wrote:

I sent you an email a few days ago asking you to explain what kind of prayers you believe are biblical since you feel that most prayers Christians pray today are unbiblical.  I have not gotten a response to that request.  Like I said in the email, I am not looking for another argument or debate.  I am genuinely interested in hearing what you have to say.  If I have been wrong all these years, I would like to investigate what is acceptable to God.  So when you have time, please let me know what it is that you believe are acceptable prayers.

Shallow

One reason I find our Bible classes and most sermons to be little more than filler is they are shallow. If you were to say God is not a "he" someone would surely tell you the Greek or Hebrew word is masculine so that means God is a "he." For one to believe in the word-for-word inspiration of the Bible they must first identify the version of the Bible so inspired. Language is our means of communication and is physical. As spirit we will have no need for language.

 

Everything we see today, everything we hear today is physical. As spirit we will neither need nor have any of them. An aborted baby and Methuselah (assuming the aborted baby is truly human and assuming the old guy makes it) will relate as if they were twins. 

 

When I hear the streets are gold I want to know where the streets go. When I hear about the pearly gates I want to know what is outside the gate. When I hear about streets of glass I want to know what you see when you look through the glass and do they reflect and what does the reflection of a spirit look like. When I hear about walls I want to know what is on the other side of the wall.

 

Once you begin considering such things the Bible opens up to you.

Have You Ever Considered. . .

Have you ever considered that once God chose the descendants of Isaac as his people he was stuck between a rock and a hard place. Imagine the creator of everything over a barrel by his creation. In fact he changed what was acceptable concerning marriage and divorce against his own just to placate his creation and to keep them from total mutiny. He knew total mutiny meant no Messiah. There is a conundrum. The creator who is omniscient and all those other omnies having to cowtow to his creation. Since Messiah has come on the scene the Creator does not need to bend to anyone or anything.

God Active Today?

During WWII one of my uncles was drafted into the Marines. He had a wife and baby daughter. My aunt was in a wheel chair. She had MS I believe and had been in that chair a couple of years. Anyway when got his marching papers she made a pact with him. If he would come back alive she would walk to meet him at the railroad station.

 

He was on Iwo Jima for 10 days. He lost part of his skull and had a metal plate in his head the rest of his live. The day he came home she walked down the platform to meet him and was never in that wheel chair again. If God had anything to do with it he got cheated because no one gave him any credit for it. She was always an example of determination and strength.

 

About 5 years or so ago Shawn and Tasha had a friend, their age, was the mother of two children around 8 to 10 years of age and she had brain cancer. Shawn and Tasha brought her and her husband and children to Gatlinburg and treated them to Dollywood. A month or so later she died. The Sunday they were here I told the fellow who was making announcements about her and asked that she be included in the announcements of people who needed prayer. She was not even mentioned by name and never referred to again after that morning.

 

Since them I have come to the conclusion that God is not active today. His actions in the OT were to keep a remnant together long enough for Messiah to be born. His actions in the NT were to show the people Jesus and the apostles were from him, God. There is no purpose for his activity today.

 

People such as yourself pick a situation that went your way and accept that it went that way because of God's interference. I do not believe it but no matter. If God is active he is very selective. Getting involved to help a person find a parking spot but staying aloof as a little girl is beaten to death. Healing that lady you mentioned but letting Shawn and Tasha's friend die. I have found people who believe God is active are people with things generally going well. 

 

So no, I do not believe God is active today.

 

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com 
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

"IF 7UP hadn't decided on a name that was short and sweet we'd still be drinking Bib-Label Lithiated Lemon-Lime Soda."

Looking Again at the Roles of Women

It appears a number of congregations are re-looking at the roles of women within the body of Christ and from what I hear a number of congregations are excommunicating those same congregations. It might be nice to study what constitutes biblical leadership, authority and submission. For instance, men are to be in submission to one another and to their spiritual leaders. To stand before their leaders, to word a prayer, to read announcements, to sing, even to hand their spiritual leaders a Communion tray is considered a violation of the principle of submission for females. A young christian boy can do all these things and never once be considered a spiritual leader in the congregation.

 

The Idea of Church is in Trouble.

Looking at the NT we see where people were immersed on Pentecost. Being immersed was their response to instructions Peter and the apostles gave to them based on their question concerning what should they do which was their reaction to being told they had killed Messiah. Luke tells us that God added to their number those being saved. We see where their number continued to increase.
 
I do not believe the Bible tells us that these people understood they had just bought in to teaching the world. Thus I do not believe they had any responsiblity beyond their sphere of existence. There is no indication of anyone going about telling the world about Jesus. When persecution began they left the city and when asked told the people why they were running for their lives.
 
It would be natural for people with like beliefs and like fears to congregate together to strengthen and encourage each other. There is nothing in the Bible they congregated to worship. That is man's idea to save their job.
 
Since that time because of King James we have to deal with his idea of those assemblies via the word church. If he had permitted that word to be changed to a meaningful word he would have lost his position as head of the church of England. Without the word church what would he have been the head of? Poof, he would have had to stick with his day job as king.
 
After James we had the preachers to contend with. To keep their day jobs they had to organize church. Today we go to church, we do church, unbelievers are the unchurched. Anyone can start a church. So the term has lost is relevance. Today, the saved are a group, one group that includes the saved of all time. We have tolerated the word church and now we have to live with it and with people's attitudes about the church as a meaningless entity. The saved will always gather to encourage each other. Those not gathered are by definition not saved. They are rejecting the group to which God added them upon their immersion. There is nothng more for them. They are lost. As others in the Bible they have gone out from us. They were never a part of us.

a way of escape?

When the Bible tells us that God will not let us be tempted beyond what we can bear and with every temptation (which he does not give us) he will provide a way of avoiding that sin. Specifically what is that telling us that God will do? If you are lusting specifically what will God do to help you avoid sinning throw cold water on us? If you sinning by not helping someone who needs help specifically what will God do to help us avoid that sin? I believe many of the problems with Christians today, especially those of the Church of Christ ilk we don't think things through. We mouth prayers because it is time for a prayer and our primary purposes are to not be tool long and not be too short. We do not want to finish the service too early and never too late. When we pray we must, it is demanded, expect. Expecting is not that God can do something but that he will do something. James makes some negative comments about anyone who asks God for something and does not expect.  

 

That is enough for now.

 

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com 
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

"IF 7UP hadn't decided on a name that was short and sweet we'd still be drinking Bib-Label Lithiated Lemon-Lime Soda."

You can count on Jesus?

Recently one of my co-workers who admittedly is recovering by overuse of drugs and alcohol commented "Jesus is the only one we can count on." The context was others will fail us but Jesus will not. Specifically what does that mean? Try to avoid generalities and be specific. In what way can Jesus be depended on today where others fail us? To give you an idea of what this guy is thinking, he says he writes poetry that God gives him. When he writes he can feel God on his shoulder and knows that God is giving him the specific words to write. God is quite dependable because he provides the words for this guy to get the credit for writing.

 

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com 
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

"IF 7UP hadn't decided on a name that was short and sweet we'd still be drinking Bib-Label Lithiated Lemon-Lime Soda."

What does "We Pray for. . ." mean?

In my continuing investigation of prayer and what it is and is not an example recently appeared on the white board in the break room for the River Rampage where I work. The message said "Pray for Greg and Marie." I found that Greg is the husband of my boss and Marie is the wife of one of my co-workers. Marie has been diagnosed with cancer but I am not sure what is wrong with Greg except it is ongoing and serious. The message says "pray for. . ."  In the assembly someone "leads" the congregation in prayer and says "we pray for (insert someones name). Specifically what does that mean? Specifically what are we asking the Creator of everything to do? Is there Bible support for whatever it is we are expecting?

 

What makes us think the Creator of the universe will do anything? He did not save any of the apostles from being killed: he did not stop the persecution we read about in the NT: He did not heal Batselle Barrett Baxter, a renowned preacher in the Church of Christ, of cancer of his brain: he allowed a little girl to be beaten to death by her mother's boyfriend: did not stop slavery in the United States: permitted Christians to starve to death in Malawi several years ago:  I could go on but you get the picture. Can it possibly be that since God has provided a number of principals concerning how we should conduct our lives and therefore will not interject himself into our trifling lives? Could it be the natural laws, which are not laws but as Shawn has explained to me merely observations by scientists of processes found in nature that have been observed to be consistent, control the outcome as he apparently planned?

 

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com 
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

"IF 7UP hadn't decided on a name that was short and sweet we'd still be drinking Bib-Label Lithiated Lemon-Lime Soda."

How Close to Socialism Does the Church have to Get?

Realizing this is probably close to socialism, what if the story in Luke and the rich man building larger barns read something like this:

Luke 12:16-21

"The investments of a rich man produced plentifully, and he thought to himself, 'What shall I do, for my bank account exceeds the FDIC insured amount?' And he said, 'I will withdraw my money and invest in Mutual Funds. And I will say to my soul, Soul, you have ample money laid up for many years; relax, eat, drink, be merry.' But God said to him, 'Fool! This night your soul is required of you, and the things you have prepared, whose will they be?' So is the one who lays up treasure for himself and is not rich toward God."

We justify what we do by saying we can lay up treasure on earth AND be rich toward God but can we?

Paul told Timothy 1 Tim. 6:17-19 "As for the rich in this present age, charge them not to be haughty, nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly provides us with everything to enjoy. They are to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share, thus storing up treasure for themselves as a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is truly life."

If we share can we still be rich? Can we keep for ourselves whatever amount it takes to be considered rich and still be rich toward God?

Concerning church funds the preacher is an example only because he is on the payroll. Can a group of Christians take money contributed to the work of the congregation and set it aside for the sole purpose of permitting the preacher to not have to work? Thus helping the preacher to set his hopes on the uncertainty of riches? Which as you see is contrary to what Paul told Timothy?

This occurred to me when a friend told me he sees a woman where he buys a paper every day who he believes is living in her car. Some of the people I work with at Dollywood live in a camp ground where a family of 4 is living. The parents sleep in a van and the children sleep in a tent and congregations of the church of Christ are setting aside money so their preacher will eventually not have to work or so the congregation can have a more comfortable building or so they can have a nice Christmas Party or so they can travel to a foreign country and teach VBS to those children. Has the church lost our focus? While the church universal is doing this so are the individual members setting aside money so we will not have to work; so we can set our hopes in the uncertainty of riches.

Are we unwilling to place our future in God's hands? Who among us is living by faith? Can we be rich towards God?

Hezekiah and Prayer

Our neighbor is convinced God finds her a parking spot when she needs one. She is convinced that if she needs something God answers her prayer and she receives it. I am dubious to say the least.

God appears to be very selective in that he finds her a parking place but lets a 4 year old girl die from ruptured organs from being beaten by her mother's boyfriend. My observation is I am now aware of God answering anyone's prayers. As for Jesus' prayers how were they answered?

You are probably convinced otherwise but I believe the Christians were praying that Peter die quickly. At that time everyone knew no one escaped Caesar's jail. To me that explains their surprise. Not a lack of faith just joy mixed with surprise.

Dez and Wilma and Debbie have been sick a long time. Does God continue to provide our neighbor with parking places while leaving Wilma and Dez and Debbie as well as scores of others today and in the past in pain and other intolerable situations? I do not believe he does that.

When Jesus told his disciples how to pray none of what we pray for was included including the "in Jesus name" thing. If James is going to be the example for praying for the sick don't you wonder why Paul left Timothy sick when all he had to do was let an elder know and Timothy would have been healed? I have never recognized the effectiveness of a righteous man praying.

One time my sister called me to tell me our dad was dying. Dottie and I went to Ohio and sure enough dad looked almost dead. We left that night expecting to return the next day to make the funeral arrangements. When Dottie and I arrived at the nursing home the next morning my sisters were there and dad had eaten two breakfasts and the nurses were trying to get him to skip a third. I can guarantee to you none of the three of us were praying for him to get better. He hated where he lived and was more than ready to die.

I would not necessarily call it psychological illusion (Karl Marx calls says religion in general is an opiate of the people) but I do wonder why no one, other than me of course, questions the fact that the prayers of the masses go unanswered and no one asks why. Especially since James says we can pray wrongly.

That raises another question why do we think all prayers are answered? Hearing us does not suggest answering. Jesus was aware Stephen was being killed but did not intervene. Surely God was aware of all the Christians murdered or tortured all these thousands of years and did not intervene. How about those Christians in Malawi who starved to death? Why are we convinced Jesus will intervene on our behalf? I am not so convinced.

It seems evidence of God answering prayer is taken from the OT never the NT. As in many situations we believe what we want to believe. I for one am not ready to give anybody any reasons why we should expect any affirmative answers to any prayer. I realize that puts me in the minority but my experience has been such personally and observation wise that there is a major gap between what we believe, or say we believe, and what I observe. And I wonder why and I wonder why I am alone in my wondering.

When my sister had breast cancer she asked me if I thought God would heal her. I told her that Jesus did not heal everyone but all those he and the apostles did heal served his purpose. So I suggested she make healing her serve Jesus' purpose. She survived two cases of cancer. Did the doctors do it on their own? I have no idea. Did it take God two tries to heal her? I have no idea. Without being too sarcastic he usually heals sprained ankles in the first attempt. And my last wonder is why does God say yes to the simple requests like parking places and broken bones but says "no" or "wait" to the more serious cases? And why am I the only one who wonders?

Any time any person prays without a complete conviction that their prayer will be answered with resounding yes is doubting and James says some negative things about people who pray in such a manner. I wonder how anyone can pray for God to heal any illness without doubting or wondering. Not questioning if he can but if he will, especially since my observations are that he never says yes.

Is Satan Active Today?

James says: James 1:5-8 If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask God, who gives generously to all without reproach, and it will be given him. But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea that is driven and tossed by the wind. For that person must not suppose that he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways.

I believe that refers wisdom and not to parking spots, safety, health etc and James says God will answer.

James also says James 1:13-15 Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God," for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one. But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire. Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death.

James does not say we sin because of Satan acting upon us. So no, I do not need Satan's help to sin. If you believe you do then you need to be able to explain who tempted Satan when he originally fell? The answer is he was lured by his own desire.

Matthew and Mark wrote Matthew 16:23 But he turned and said to Peter, "Get behind me, Satan! You are a hindrance to me. For you are not setting your mind on the things of God, but on the things of man."

Jesus was talking to Peter but he called him Satan. I understand that to be telling us that Peter was advancing Satan's position so he was acting as Satan in that situation. Anyone who is not advancing God's positions is advancing Satan's.

In the garden Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any other beast of the field that the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God actually say, 'You shall not eat of any tree in the garden'?"

It does not say Satan but serpent. The serpent was advancing Satan's agenda so it is said Satan tempted Eve. Satan did via the intention of the crafty serpent.

Genesis also says Genesis 3:14-15

The Lord God said to the serpent,

"Because you have done this,

cursed are you above all livestock

and above all beasts of the field;

on your belly you shall go,

and dust you shall eat

all the days of your life.

I will put enmity between you and the woman,

and between your offspring and her offspring;

he shall bruise your head,

and you shall bruise his heel."

Why punish the serpent if it was Satan working through her (serpent must have been a woman)?

In Job it says a storm or something killed Job's children. Satan used nature to get to Job. I do not believe he is behind the storms today. Unless of course he is targeting someone but we have no evidence he is allowed to do that ort of stuff today

So No, I do not believe Satan is active in the world other than people advancing his positions versus advancing God's positions.

Does God Ever Say "Yes"?

My experience has been one that God does not answer prayers. Always saying "No!" leads me to believe he is not active in the world today. Where does the bible refute such a statement? What supports the Christian's wish that God is active?

One of the reasons for my doubts is the number of public prayers that go unanswered and no one questions. That suggests no one expects anything. James has some negative things to say about praying without expecting. But how can we expect when we have never experienced? God apparently has no problems with finding parking spaces and healing sprained ankles but more serious situations appear to be out of his sphere of influence.

When Jesus told his disciples how to pray he did not pray anything like we pray today. We pray about and for things for which we have no Bible support and no one questions. Lacking of questioning gives credibility to Karl Marx's comment about religion being opiate of the people.

Has it Occurred

Have you considered when Christians look to government, laws, court decisions to enforce moral issues they are allowing the government laws and courts to decide how to apply? If the government can exclude abortion it can include it. If government can exclude divorce for any reason it can include it. Same with gay marriage. Christians need to stop looking to government, laws and the courts and get back to evangelism.

Gay Marriage or No Gay Marriage, that is the question.

Watching the demonstrations in California and Georgia of the "For Gay Marriage" and the "Against Gay Marriage" groups it occurs to me why is it that Government is involved?

Have you ever wondered why government has such an interest in "marriage?" And why is it that a person who "performs" or "officiates" the "ceremony" has to be licensed by the state? During Colonial times "license" meant permission to do something considered not legal? Not legal does not mean illegal it means something not permitted. People could not do something King George did not allow so they got a "license" to serve beer, open a print shop etc.

Some five hundred or so years ago a "Marriage Ordinance" was created requiring "state registration" and "church consecration." This means that prior to that time government was not in the business of recognizing marriage. The early Christians did not require Rome's permission for them to commit to each other and build families. Neither should we be so required.

God created the concept of the family but man inserted government involvement. God did not identify how two become one just that they do. I do not believe Mary and Joseph asked Rome's permission to become one. With government involvement comes government's allowing for the "putting asunder."

Sex apparently is part of the reason, for otherwise uninvolved individuals, to want government to become involved in personal business because the lack of "consummation" is often used as a valid reason to void the agreement. Maybe the whole business is about sex? If you want to read more see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage

On the subject of Gay Marriage we have two sides attempting to force their opinions on the country. Christians want the world to believe what they believe without their same background. The world wants everyone to be allowed to do anything they want, with anyone/anything they want, whenever they want, wherever they are.

As ignorant as most Christians are of the Bible they are even more ignorant of the Constitution. Marriage is NOT a Constitutional issue. The newest Supreme Court Justice agrees with that statement. Public opinion is never a valid measurement due to how often it changes and how often it is wrong. Lest we forget how popular opinion led to the extinction of some and destruction of most of the tribes of Native Americans, dehumanizing of the remaining Native Americans, slavery of men, women and children, segregation of the races, the murders of gay men, abortion, current divorce laws, are just a few that come to mind.

In business it is often easier to ask forgiveness than to ask permission. Our governments, federal, state, and local often operate on that beliefl. They do what they like and see if the populace objects. For examples remember how Abraham Lincoln violated the Constitution, how George Bush 43 violated the Constitution and how our current leader Barrack Obama violates the Constitution and the people remain quiet and ignorant.

What we need is for governments to eliminate all perks for the married. Whose business is it if two people want to commit to each other whatever their gender? Whose business is it if they decide they no longer want to commit to each other. It is certainly not government business. Allowing that moral issues are involved they are best addressed by Jesus and we should let him. Of course that will require that Christians do something other than protest.

Music Debate

Tom Alexander:

Reference the July 2010 issue of Gospel Advocate, "Music Debate."

While I like your article may I make a comment or two . . or three?

Charley Brown was shooting arrows and then drawing a circle around each arrow. Lucy asked him why he was doing that and Charley replied "this way I never miss."

Many times we do that to prove our positions. To use anyone other than the bible to support out point indicates we do not believe the prophets, apostles, etc are sufficient. Because someone in the second or third century did or did not do something does not provide evidence to support our position. The bible is enough or it is not. If it is not then anything goes.

Nowhere in the New Testament did anyone, including Jesus, tell the "good people" to separate themselves from the "bad people." You can reference Paul's letters as well as Jesus' instructions to the churches in Asia. I understand that to mean that nothing anyone else in the assembly does affects badly on me. Considering Jesus' instructions that our loving each other will show the world we are his disciples may suggest that splitting a congregation over any issue just may be the worst thing that can be done and that all sides are at fault and need to seek forgiveness.

Last, you base your position on the fact that our assemblies are for worship. Where do you find bible support for that view? Paul told the church at Rome that worship was when they presented their individual body as a living sacrifice. The author of Hebrews says our assemblies are for the purpose of encouraging each other to love and good works. I have asked many preachers and authors this question and I have never received a response. I take that to mean they consider my question so ridiculous it does not deserve an answer or most likely that they have no clue and that is their story and they are sticking to it.

For me I do not favor instruments in the assembly because I cannot find it in the Bible. Not that it is wrong just that I cannot find it. And once you get outside of the Bible anything goes. Anyone who wants instruments will hit a wall someplace. They like a piano but do not like drums; they like individual instruments but not bands and orchestras; everyone has a line in the sand and mine is the Bible.

Did the people immersed on Pentecost sign up to convert the world? Were they told on Pentecost if they did not they were going to Hell and having been immersed would not save them from that fate? I do not believe that to be the case so neither do we have that responsibility today. The church is nothing more and nothing less than a group of people who have been immersed and had their sins forgiven. Something no other group can claim. If we would live as if that were true others would see it and want what we have. As it is most live so close to the line that neither their brothers and sisters nor the world can see a separation. Our responsibility as a group is to encourage each other to love and to do good works; to follow Jesus' example, instructions and commands. We have made things much more complicated than they need to be.

I liked your article but I suggest it does not convince anyone who does not already agree with you.

This note is much too long so I will close. If you are still reading this I thank you for your time. If you care to explain how singing to each other, praying for ourselves, contributing primarily for our own comfort, listening to a speaker is worship I will be interested in your thoughts. We have memorial services all of the time for our friends and do not consider that worship so calling the Lord's Supper worship is a stretch.

I am John Jenkins. I am retired. My wife and I live in Gatlinburg and meet with Great Smoky Mountains Church of Christ in Pigeon Forge. Most of whom will agree 100% with your article.

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179 cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

Some people are like a Slinky ... Not really good for anything, but you
still can't help but smile when you shove them down the stairs.

What Would Paul Do?

Recently I was reading an article "Is Your Religion Enough?"  The author writes:

There is plenty of religion and the assortment is nearly unlimited so take your pick. But wait a minute, what is religion all about anyway?

The business of religion can be very confusing unless we can sort out the real issues. What are the issues? The greatest issue is sin.

He later writes

Is your religion providing the power for you to be able to overcome temptation? Does your religion enable you to live a pure life in an immoral society? Has your religion separated you from your former evil habits, friends, and the world? Do you call that sin which the Bible calls sin?  Has your religion brought you into obedience to the Bible?

The author suggests that if our answers to those questions are not an honest "Yes" is our religion enough.

Considering some recent events at PF it appears our newer members were not separating themselves from their old friends or their old habits.

Yesterday while passing the communion trays I was underwhelmed by the clothing of many of the girls in that ministry trip group. Their shorts were extremely short at least while they were sitting. Considering the amount of cleavage and legs on display during the service on the usual Sunday I wonder if Paul would have warned them they are walking too close to the line. Or do you suppose he would have waited until they were pregnant and told them they should have been more careful.

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com 
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

Some people are like a Slinky ... Not really good for anything, but you
still can't help but smile when you shove them down the stairs.

Freedom of Religion

We do not need to do anything today that the first Christians did not do to "go about preaching the gospel." Our lackadaisical attitude in the assembly. Sitting and listening does not promote evangelism. Playing at "worship" does not promote evangelism. Meeting to provoke one another to love and good works does promote evangelism. Those first Christians met to encourage each other not to go to practice a litany of liturgy.

Results

The Psalms has many places where David thanked God for answering his prayers. I cannot find an example of the results of such a prayer. David was afraid of Saul, he ran, he hid. What example can we find where one of David's prayers was answered. Similar to our prayers. We say we believe in prayer and that prayer "works." What example can we find where one of our prayers (public) produced results? The basis for the question is Muslims pray, what results does it produce? Methodists pray, what results does it produce. Are we deluding ourselves or are we erroneously praying? If the prayer of a righteous man "availeth" much does it mean I have never met a righteous man? I find it intriguing that for over 40 years I have never seen an example of a public prayer producing results. Apparently God can handle the flu and a broken leg or wrist but history indicates cancer or other serious illnesses get the best of him every time. He can even find a parking spot but when it comes to the more serious problems his batting average is -0-. I wonder why. No one questions just continues. Are we deluding ourselves?

Faith is a Risk---Whatever You Believe / Ben Carson, MD

Faith is a Risk---Whatever You Believe

Ben Carson, MD

Where did the first living cell come from? Darwin built his entire theory of evolution on the premise that the cell is the simplest, foundational building block of life.

The electron microscope and countless other contemporary tools have only begun to show us how incredibly complex a cell truly is. You have a cell membrane with lipoproteins phasically interposed with positive and negative charges that can allow certain types of molecules to pass through or not, a very complex nucleus and nucleolus, endoplasmic reticulum with ribosomes on it that are able to understand and replicate genetic patterns, and Golgi apparatuses that generate energy. We haven't even begun to discuss genes, the intricate communication patterns of DNA, or any number of additional subcellular ingredients and their functions. If cells are the original starting point of life, how did all of those complex interrelated parts and processes come to be?

But let's just concede that somehow, mysteriously, the first cell about. Where did the great diversity of other cells come from? Darwinism holds that all life evolved in a gradual, progressive, step-by-step process from the simple to the complex. So how did the earlier, simpler single cells all get together to form more complex multi celled organism?

Consider a single eye. How did a rod cell just sit there for millions and millions of years until a cone cell could develop? Then how did multiple rods and cones come together into an intricate visual-sensory apparatus, embedded into the retina as part of a complex neurovascular network, which converts images into electrical information to be passed through the neural network along the optic nerve and reinterpreted in the occipital cortex of the brain as a recognizable image? Even before we get to the retina, what about the pupil? Where and how did it develop in isolation---because there would be no purpose for it without those other things? Nor would there be any purpose for the iris without the pupil and the anterior chamber. There would be no purpose for the cornea, no purpose for the short ciliary nerves, no purpose for any of it without all the other stuff.

Did each type of cell develop on its own and then sit around and wait for a couple of billion years in the hope that some perfectly compatible cell type might come along to finally make it not merely relevant but indispensable as part of an elaborate system that itself complements even more complex systems that are in turn part of the larger organism? How does that jibe with the "survival of the fittest" premise, in which function is a key factor in deciding what genetically useful characteristics are passed on and ultimately which organisms last another generation? Are we then to believe that specialized cells survived for millions of years, fit for no real purpose, until other specialized and completely worthless and unfit cells came along, which also survived for untold eons, to one day combine with them in anticipation of filling some future need that would take millions of more generations and evolutionary steps?

Believing that the origin of life can be explained by Darwinian evolution requires more faith than I have. Evolution and creationism both require faith. It's just a matter of where you choose to place that faith.