Silly Story

It is said that the bible starts with a silly, unscientific story of how the world was made in seven days.  Christians are disturbed by the fact that those who take the bible seriously do not agree on the creation account. Some think the only faithful interpretation is the young-earth, literal view of the Genesis days that was made famous by Archbishop Ussher (1581 – 1656) who gave 4004 BC as the date of the origin of the earth. His calculation, based on the days in Genesis 1 as twenty-four-hour days of one earth week at the beginning of the universe does not coincide with current scientific estimate of around four billion years.

 

Others hold the text can be understood in agreement with contemporary science. Such old earth creationists are split over the validity of Darwin's theory of evolution. Others argue that the Genesis account was written to communicate timeless theological truth and attempts to harmonies with science are misguided.

OT Not Written To Us

The Old Testament does communicate to us and it was written for us and for all people. But it was not written to us. It was written to Israel and through Israel to everyone else. Since it was written to Israel it is in a language that most of us do not understand, and therefore requires translation.  But the language is not the only aspect that needs to be translated. Language assumes a culture, operates in a culture, serves a culture, and is designed to communicate into the framework of a culture. Consequently, when we read a text written in another language and addressed to another culture we must translate the culture as well as the language if we hope to understand the text fully. 8

Christians Argue for ID

When Christians argue for intelligent design (ID) to be taught in public schools they typically avoid explicit reference to God.

 

They argue ID is scientific rather than religious and occasionally suggest the designer could be a space alien or a time-traveling cell biologist but they offer no serious alternative to God as a designer. ID's religious nature is evident because it involves a supernatural designer. In one court case the judge observed, "that several individuals who so staunchly and proudly touted their religious convictions in public, would time and again lie to cover their tracks and disguise the real purpose behind their ID policy.

 

In Matters Obscure

Concerning teaching evolution in schools Christians need to understand that science is here to stay. Regardless the flaws and unknowns Christians may see in scientific knowledge, science will continue its attempt to solve the puzzles of the world of nature; evolution.

The church's condemnation of Galileo did not bring astronomy to a halt. Quite the opposite we have a more informed awareness of the universe.

Those who find fault with the theory of evolution may want to keep it out of the school curriculum but millions of dollars will continue to fund thousands of scientists doing research of evolution.  Thousands of scientists are doing everything they can to overthrow the current theory of evolution and so far have been not succeeded. On the other hand Christians do not question their convictions.

Nature abounds in catastrophes, disasters, imperfections, dysfunctions, suffering and cruelty. Tsunamis destroy and kill; volcanoes erase cities such as Pompei and Herculaneum, killing all their citizens; floods and droughts bring ruin to farmers. The human jaw is poorly designed, parasites kill millions of humans every year and make additional hundreds of millions sick. About 20 percent of all human pregnancies end in spontaneous abortion during the first two months. That is 20 million natural abortions every year. Is that the work of a loving creator or the results of the clumsy evolutionary process?  

--- Augustine of Hippo (354 - 480) with specific reference to Genesis said:

"In matters that are so obscure and far beyond our vision, we find in Holy Scripture passages which can be interpreted in very different ways without prejudice to the faith we have received. In such cases, we should not rush in headlong and so firmly take our stand on one side that, if further progress in the search for truth justly undermines this position, we too fall with it."

 

 

 

Which Sixth Grade?

Folks say the bible was written at the sixth-grade level the question is which sixth-grade? The six-grade today is more advanced than the sixth-grade of hundred years ago which was more advanced than the equivalent 1,000 years before that which was more advanced than the equivalent in the time of Moses. So which sixth-grade do they mean?

 

The books of the bible were written at a level that was comprehendible by the people living at the time.

Concerning Science

Concerning science Christians continue to believe the sun rises and sets, the moon shines and the sky is blue all proven by science to be not true.

God Does Not Protect the Innocent

Recently there were stories in the news of a woman babysitting for a child put that child in cold bath water and set the child outside in the cold weather. The child's body temperature was around 87 degrees. Another story was of a couple who punished their child by putting him in an oven. But Christians continue to groupthink that God is in control and will answer their prayers for safety, health and comforts. Folks around here are "rooting for Reagan." Why would God select Reagan out of the thousands or maybe hundreds of thousands of children who die each day of sickness, ill treatment of the people around them? If God is not going to protect the innocent of his creation he will not protect anyone. Christians also believe God knew those children were going to be tortured and still caused them to be born. Did God cause or let? As with those children and thousands like them God will let bad things happen to Christians whose prayers land on deaf ears.

 

Evolution 1 Creation 0

One advantage evolution has over creation, which supports its veracity, is the fact that scientists around the world are trying to disprove evolution while Christians continue to groupthink that the days of creation in Genesis were 24-hour days and the earth is 6,000 years-old.

 

More than 100 insect species have developed resistance to DDT in parts of the world where spraying has been intense. Although these species had never encountered this synthetic compound, mutations gave them some advantage that allowed them to survive in its presence. That adaptation was rapidly multiplied by natural selection.

 

The same goes for disease-causing bacteria and parasites to antibiotics and other drugs as a consequence of the same process. When an individual receives an antibiotic that specifically kills the bacteria causing a disease such as tuberculosis the majority of bacteria die but some may have a mutation that provides resistance to the antibiotic. These resistant bacteria will survive and multiply and that antibiotic will no longer cure the disease. That survival is considered natural selection.

 

Evolution is considered known science today while creation cannot be known and is unprovable

 

Those factual examples cause me to wonder how natural selection has affected human-beings.

.

What Government Prohibits Government May Permit

Recently a republican announced he has changed his position on the subject and now supports same-sex marriage. Also recently Hillary Clinton announced she has now changed her position on the subject and supports same-sex marriage. It appears the subject is gaining momentum. What I have suggested appears to be coming to be and that is when Christians depend upon government to support their moral views they must be prepared to accept what government prohibits government may permit.

The Real Problem

Reference previous email, the field of science called embryology offers a complex sequence of naturalistic cause-and-effect for the development of a child. Christians' biblical belief does not associate God's work only with those aspects that remain a mystery. God is involved with the entire process start to finish.  He made us so that the process can work the way it does and Christians believe each child is his handiwork. To accept that does not require that Christians reject the science of embryology.

This is also true in history. Christians believe that God is in control of history and shapes events moment by moment. Despite that claim no historian is able to see God's hand clearly, though depending on one's presuppositions one may conclude that God is at work. Some of those conclusions would be the result of incredible coincidences, while others would be the result of that which is otherwise unexplainable.

Christians believe that God controls history, but they do not object when historians talk about a natural cause-and-effect process. Christians believe God controls the weather, yet they do not denounce meteorologists who produce their weather maps day to day based on the predictability of natural cause-and-effect processes. Why can't evolution be thought of in similar terms?

It would be unacceptable to adopt an evolutionary view as a process without God. It would equally unacceptable to adopt history, embryology or meteorology as processes without God. The fact that embryology or meteorology do not identify God's role or that many embryologists and meteorologists do not believe God has a role makes a difference. Christians can accept the results of embryology and meteorology, regardless of the beliefs of the scientists, as processes that Christians believe describe in part God's way of working. Christians do not organize campaigns to force academic institutions that train meteorologists or embryologists to offer the theological alternative of God's role. Why do you suppose Christians' response to evolution is any different?

Do you suppose Christians' misunderstanding the true meaning of Genesis 1, 2, and 3 is the cause of the disagreement?

Science and Christianity

Have you considered the debate between evolution and creationism concerns how not who? No matter what science says Christians say God did it. That would be correct no matter what science suggests. 

David said "You knit me together in my mother's womb." This and other statements in the bible credit God as creator of each human being in the womb. This act of creation is not instantaneous but involves a process. Yet it is the work of God. This process is well understood by science. From the process of fertilization, implantation, fetal development and birth, scientists find that which is explainable, predictable, and regular. Science offers a complex sequence of naturalistic cause and effect for the development of a child yet life remains a mystery.

Christians base their disagreement with evolutionists on their belief Genesis 1,2 and 3 are literal but are they? We know sin did not enter the world through Adam. The bible tells us that by the time Adam sinned two members of the creation had sinned, the serpent and Eve. Sin entered the world through the serpent that had a conversation with Eve. Sin did not literally enter the world through Adam so Adam must represent human kind. If Adam is not literal maybe the rest of the account is not also. 

Historically  the church has been wrong when science differed with current Christian beliefs. What science has going for it that Christians do not is the fact that every scientist would love to disprove the theory of evolution. So far they have been unable to do that but not due to the lack of effort. Christians only challenge those who differ with them never those who agree with them.

Death in the Garden?

 

 

 

Paul told the church at Rome "just as sin entered the world through one man and death through sin and in this way death came to all men because all sinned." First of all we know sin entered the world through the serpent then Eve not Adam. By the time Adam sinned two of God's creation had sinned. Second sin was not a direct cause of death but the reason God used to take away Adam and Eve's contact with the tree of life. Allowing for free will, if Adam and Eve had chosen to not take advantage of the tree of life they would have died without sin. In a manner of speaking the Serpent was right but failed to take into account God's taking the tree of life away.

 

Some folks have decided that Paul's statement in Romans means there was no death at any level prior to the entrance of sin. But the verse does not say that. Paul is talking about how death came to people and why all humanity is subject to death. Just because death came to us as a result of Eve's sin does not mean death did not exist at any level prior to that point.

 

On the third day we have the description of the process by which plants grow. The cycle of sprouting leaves, flowers, fruit and seeds involves death at every stage. The system functions with death as part of it.

 

Likewise with animals: it is obvious when we look at predatory meat eaters to see that the food chain involves death. A caterpillar eating a leaf brings death. A bird eating the caterpillar brings death. Fish eating insects brings death. If animals and insects did not die they would overwhelm their environment and the ecology would suffer. Our skin has an outer layer of dead cells and we know Adam had skin. Consider the manner in which predators kill. Unless God punished the animals for Eve's sin pain would have been experienced by the prey prior to the serpent.

 

All this indicates that death did exist in the garden before sin. Resistance to death was not due to Adam and Eve having immoral bodies but was due to having access to the tree of life.

 

Some folks explain all that away by saying God limited the reproduction of the insects and all animals were vegetarian. The great thing about religion is everyone is comfortable with what they want to believe.

 

We talk about a car flying down the road. Our meaning is the car is moving quickly. If we found that in the bible we would be taught that car's fly. We talk about the day of the lord. We are told day means twenty-four hours so apparently the lord only had twenty four hours? We have to look beyond the words and find the meaning.

John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN



Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Blogs: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/
          http://alumcave.blogspot.com/

 

"If stupidity got us into this mess, then why can't it get us out?" 

 

--- Will Rogers (1879-1935)

 

 

The Story of Stuff: http://www.storyofstuff.com/

Limiting Sources of Information

Years ago Robert Townsend wrote a book Up the Organization. At the time he thought a CEO should not remain with a corporation longer than five years due to Townsend's opinion that if the CEO remained longer the CEO's personality would override the corporation's personality.  Ideas would be lost due to people thinking, the CEO would never go for that one so it was never suggested; new CEO new thinking etc.

 

Recently I saw where a preacher was being honored for being with the same congregation for fifty-years. While those folks were proud I thought how sad. For fifty years that congregation must have a very narrow view of scriptures due to being limited to one man's beliefs, opinions etc for half a century. GSMCOC has been limited to one man's views, opinions etc for around twenty years. Ideas have been lost due to people thinking HE would never go for that one so it was never suggested.

 

This could be among the numerous reasons for the church shrinking relative to the population as well as to it self. Congregations dulled by the thinking of one man. For example during Gary's first budget presentation he suggested the congregation become more involved in Honduras i.e. sending local people to visit and encourage. When Al stood up to "pee of the pulpit" the first thing he said was sending is as good as going. He shot down Gary's idea before it was cold. The people to whom Jesus was speaking had no choice. We have a choice because Jesus was not speaking to us. Gary is right if we want to support the work. Al is right because we have no responsibility in that area.

 

No where does the bible suggest or encourage our practice of paying a hireling to minister to the congregation. David Lipscomb was against paid preachers due to the logical conclusion the preacher would preach to keep his job instead of preaching the bible. We are dull because we choose to limit our sources of information.

Genesis

 

"In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth" but when it comes to the timing and means of creation, particularly the interpretation of the sequence of days with which Genesis begins people have found the Bible not as easy to understand. Some believe the Bible "starts with a very silly, unscientific story of how the world was made in seven days." Even those who take the Bible seriously do not agree on the interpretation of the creation account.

 

Archbishop Ussher gave 4004 BC as the date for the origin of the earth. His calculation, based on taking the days of Genesis 1 as twenty-four hour days of one earth week at the beginning of the universe was quite different that the current scientific estimate of around four billion years.

 

Saint Augustine (A.D. 354-430) in The Literal Meaning of Genesis wrote:

 

Usually, even a non-Christian knows something about the earth, the heavens, and the other elements of this world, about the motion and orbit of the stars and even their size and relative positions, about the predictable eclipses of the sun and moon, the cycles of the years and the seasons, about the kinds of animals, shrubs, stones, and so forth, and this knowledge he hold to as being certain from reason and experience.

 

Now, it is a disgraceful and dangerous thing for an infidel to hear a Christian, presumably giving the meaning of Holy Scripture, talking nonsense on these topics; and we should take all means to prevent such an embarrassing situation, in which people show up vast ignorance in a Christian and laugh it to scorn.

 

The shame is not so much that an ignorant individual is derided, but that people outside the household of faith think our sacred writers held such opinions, and, to the great loss of those for whose salvation we toil, the writers of our Scripture are criticized and rejected as unlearned men. If they find a Christian mistaken in a field which they themselves know well and hear him maintaining his foolish opinions about our books, how are they going to believe those books in matters concerning the resurrection of the dead, the hope of eternal life, and the kingdom of heaven, when they think their pages are full of falsehoods and on facts which they themselves have learnt from experience in the light of reason?

 

Reckless and incompetent expounders of Holy Scripture bring untold trouble and sorrow on their wiser brethren when they are caught in one of their mischievous false opinions and are taken to task by those who are not bound by the authority of our sacred books. For then, to defend their utterly foolish and obviously untrue statements, they will try to call upon Holy Scripture for proof and even recite from memory many passages which they think support their position, although "they understand neither what they say nor the things about which they make assertion. "[1 Timothy 1.7]

 

 

Galileo Galilei, an Italian physicist, mathematician, astronomer, and philosopher wrote:

 

"I do not feel obliged to believe the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason and intellect has intended us to forgo their use"

 

Might be a motto for Christians today.

 

 

God's Intervention

When we ask God to intervene we are asking him to cause something to happen or to let something happen that we believe would not have happen or may not have happened without his intervention.

 

Perhaps on rare occasions God does perform miracles but for the most part the existence of free will and of order in the physical universe are facts. While we might wish for such miraculous deliverance to occur more often frequent miraculous interventions would be at least as chaotic in the physical realm as they would be in interfering with human acts of free will.

 

On the subject of pain of human existence, If God is loving and wishes the best for us, then perhaps his plan is not the same as our plan.  This a hard concept if we have been too regularly spoon-fed a version of God's benevolence that implies nothing more on his part than a desire for us to be perpetually happy.

Folks Who Have Never Heard about Jesus

Yesterday, Bob mentioned, groups of people in Africa who had never heard the gospel and how God knew their hearts etc. I don't know if he was being hypothetical for an illustration or not but there are such people at least in South America such as the Nukak tribe, 1,200 isolated Indians who inhabited the forests close to Rio Pure National Park.

 

In 1981, a U.S. evangelical group, traveled into their territory without permission of the Nukak and, with gifts of machetes and axes, enticed some of the families to their camp. This contact convinced other Nukaks to seek similar gifts from the settlers at the edge of their territory. This set in motion a downward spiral leading to the deaths of hundreds of Nukaks from respiratory infections, violent clashes with land grabbers and drug traffickers and dispersal of the survivors.

 

Hundreds were forcibly displaced to the town of San Jose Del Guevara where they are living and dying in terrible conditions. They are fed, receive money from the government, and similar to our Native Americans live in squalor. Assimilation has brought poverty, alcoholism, unemployment or utter dependence on outsiders.

 

This all was done with the intent to save their souls.

 

During their search for people living in the rain forest, groups make daily aerial reconnaissance. One day a team reported that thick drifting clouds made it impossible to get a prolonged view of the rain forest floor. Several structures within an area of about five-square miles were sighted but the dwellings never stayed visible long enough to photograph them. They would see a structure and a cloud would close in quickly. The cloud cover and a storm that sprang up out of nowhere and pushed their airplane around left the team with one conclusion: the tribe had called upon its shamans to send the intruders a message and was making them pay for what they were doing.

 

As Bob mentioned in the bible class yesterday in his story of the flat tire was that Satan or the Holy Spirit?

John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN



Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Blogs: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/
          http://alumcave.blogspot.com/

 

"If stupidity got us into this mess, then why can't it get us out?" 

 

--- Will Rogers (1879-1935)

 

 

The Story of Stuff: http://www.storyofstuff.com/

Trillion Dollar Coin vs Wampum

There has been some talk that the Federal government should settle the national debt by minting a platinum coin and arbitrarily give it a trillion dollar valuation. Native Americans did something similar when they gave great value to what they called wampum. Wampum was considered valuable because shells were difficult to find, did not exist everywhere and there was intensive labor involved. What we would consider trinkets were consider valuable by Native Americans. Other than just because we say it is what could make any coin worth a trillion dollars?

In early America there was the argument over how much profit a pious person should make on a given transaction called the "fair price" controversy in the Puritan communities. Our culture does not understand the question.  Free market theory dictates one motive in economic culture: getting the max. Early colonists combined piety and humility into their economic lives. Spiritual considerations. There is the story about the English merchant, Robert Keayne, who couldn't stop confessing the sin of overcharging. Keayne was a Puritan tradesman from London who made it big and set up trade over here and got caught up in overcharging.

He wrote of his remorse in his 50,000 word will, 158 pages, which explored the whole business of revaluing, of cheating, etc.  The question he addressed was could you be a Christian and make money.

Some argued that Protestants were driven to make money and create urban centers of wealth to display it because these were an external sign that one had been saved, chosen by God to enter into his grace and be redeemed. But in fact most of the Protestant heretics who settled America believed that salvation was a matter between God and the individual, no matter what their bank balance---and that too much wealth could signify the opposite of sanctification: greed and spiritual degradation. Thus the "fair price" controversy called the "Puritan "double bind." They were against exhibitionism. There were moral prohibitions against making as much as you possibly could---that's not good! You have to do it within constraints.  

Compare that with our wealth worshiping culture, our attitude toward the "1 percent"---envy and moral disapproval. Maybe judges should sentence insider traders to write a 50,000-word apology while in prison. 

 

 

John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN



Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Blogs: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/
          http://alumcave.blogspot.com/

 

"If stupidity got us into this mess, then why can't it get us out?" 

 

--- Will Rogers (1879-1935)

 

 

The Story of Stuff: http://www.storyofstuff.com/

Christians Controlling Government

On the subject of Christians influencing government, when the founders of the United States added the 8th amendment to the Constitution prohibiting excessive bail, extensive fines, and cruel and unusual punishment they did not have the prick of a needle (our lethal injection) in mind. They were used to punishments such as "flaying alive" and being "drawn and quartered."

 

Do you know what being "flayed alive" means?  The prisoner was tied to a stake hands above his head and his feet secured. Skin was removed from head to toe; the prisoner was disemboweled while still alive. There were other procedures but the prisoner customarily died before the punishment was completed.

 

How about "drawn and quartered; the convicted was hanged, by the neck, until almost dead; strapped down and their abdominal area sliced open, their bowels and genitals would be removed and burn before their eyes; beheaded by an axe; their body divided into four sections (quartered) and, along with their head, put on public display in an attempt to deter people from similar crimes. For reasons of public decency, women convicted of similar crimes were instead burnt at the stake. With modifications the punishment was on the books in England until 1870. The most famous case was Guy Faux who was convicted of trying to blow up parliament. His mistake was thinking he could beat the system. When the rope was around his neck he jumped thinking he would break his neck but he broke the rope. He then went through the final steps fully conscious.  England has holiday, Guy Faux Day.

 

Witchcraft was a capital crime. The legal precedent cited by the devoutly Puritan colonists was the bible; biblical passages such as Exodus 22:18 ("Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live") and Leviticus 20:27 ("A man also or woman that hath a familiar spirit, or that is a wizard, shall surely be put to death"). Problem was there were no witches but that did not stop Christians from thinking there were some.

 

These punishments were enforced by Christians (?) so when the subject is Christians in government we have to be careful. Our war for freedom from Britain was conducted by people who believed owning and mistreating human beings was acceptable behavior and did not want anyone to vote who was not a white protestant, male, land owner.

 

Now presume you are not one of the selected would you still want Christians running the government?