Is Satan Active Today?

James says: James 1:5-8 If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask God, who gives generously to all without reproach, and it will be given him. But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea that is driven and tossed by the wind. For that person must not suppose that he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways.

I believe that refers wisdom and not to parking spots, safety, health etc and James says God will answer.

James also says James 1:13-15 Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God," for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one. But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire. Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death.

James does not say we sin because of Satan acting upon us. So no, I do not need Satan's help to sin. If you believe you do then you need to be able to explain who tempted Satan when he originally fell? The answer is he was lured by his own desire.

Matthew and Mark wrote Matthew 16:23 But he turned and said to Peter, "Get behind me, Satan! You are a hindrance to me. For you are not setting your mind on the things of God, but on the things of man."

Jesus was talking to Peter but he called him Satan. I understand that to be telling us that Peter was advancing Satan's position so he was acting as Satan in that situation. Anyone who is not advancing God's positions is advancing Satan's.

In the garden Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any other beast of the field that the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God actually say, 'You shall not eat of any tree in the garden'?"

It does not say Satan but serpent. The serpent was advancing Satan's agenda so it is said Satan tempted Eve. Satan did via the intention of the crafty serpent.

Genesis also says Genesis 3:14-15

The Lord God said to the serpent,

"Because you have done this,

cursed are you above all livestock

and above all beasts of the field;

on your belly you shall go,

and dust you shall eat

all the days of your life.

I will put enmity between you and the woman,

and between your offspring and her offspring;

he shall bruise your head,

and you shall bruise his heel."

Why punish the serpent if it was Satan working through her (serpent must have been a woman)?

In Job it says a storm or something killed Job's children. Satan used nature to get to Job. I do not believe he is behind the storms today. Unless of course he is targeting someone but we have no evidence he is allowed to do that ort of stuff today

So No, I do not believe Satan is active in the world other than people advancing his positions versus advancing God's positions.

Does God Ever Say "Yes"?

My experience has been one that God does not answer prayers. Always saying "No!" leads me to believe he is not active in the world today. Where does the bible refute such a statement? What supports the Christian's wish that God is active?

One of the reasons for my doubts is the number of public prayers that go unanswered and no one questions. That suggests no one expects anything. James has some negative things to say about praying without expecting. But how can we expect when we have never experienced? God apparently has no problems with finding parking spaces and healing sprained ankles but more serious situations appear to be out of his sphere of influence.

When Jesus told his disciples how to pray he did not pray anything like we pray today. We pray about and for things for which we have no Bible support and no one questions. Lacking of questioning gives credibility to Karl Marx's comment about religion being opiate of the people.

Has it Occurred

Have you considered when Christians look to government, laws, court decisions to enforce moral issues they are allowing the government laws and courts to decide how to apply? If the government can exclude abortion it can include it. If government can exclude divorce for any reason it can include it. Same with gay marriage. Christians need to stop looking to government, laws and the courts and get back to evangelism.

Gay Marriage or No Gay Marriage, that is the question.

Watching the demonstrations in California and Georgia of the "For Gay Marriage" and the "Against Gay Marriage" groups it occurs to me why is it that Government is involved?

Have you ever wondered why government has such an interest in "marriage?" And why is it that a person who "performs" or "officiates" the "ceremony" has to be licensed by the state? During Colonial times "license" meant permission to do something considered not legal? Not legal does not mean illegal it means something not permitted. People could not do something King George did not allow so they got a "license" to serve beer, open a print shop etc.

Some five hundred or so years ago a "Marriage Ordinance" was created requiring "state registration" and "church consecration." This means that prior to that time government was not in the business of recognizing marriage. The early Christians did not require Rome's permission for them to commit to each other and build families. Neither should we be so required.

God created the concept of the family but man inserted government involvement. God did not identify how two become one just that they do. I do not believe Mary and Joseph asked Rome's permission to become one. With government involvement comes government's allowing for the "putting asunder."

Sex apparently is part of the reason, for otherwise uninvolved individuals, to want government to become involved in personal business because the lack of "consummation" is often used as a valid reason to void the agreement. Maybe the whole business is about sex? If you want to read more see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage

On the subject of Gay Marriage we have two sides attempting to force their opinions on the country. Christians want the world to believe what they believe without their same background. The world wants everyone to be allowed to do anything they want, with anyone/anything they want, whenever they want, wherever they are.

As ignorant as most Christians are of the Bible they are even more ignorant of the Constitution. Marriage is NOT a Constitutional issue. The newest Supreme Court Justice agrees with that statement. Public opinion is never a valid measurement due to how often it changes and how often it is wrong. Lest we forget how popular opinion led to the extinction of some and destruction of most of the tribes of Native Americans, dehumanizing of the remaining Native Americans, slavery of men, women and children, segregation of the races, the murders of gay men, abortion, current divorce laws, are just a few that come to mind.

In business it is often easier to ask forgiveness than to ask permission. Our governments, federal, state, and local often operate on that beliefl. They do what they like and see if the populace objects. For examples remember how Abraham Lincoln violated the Constitution, how George Bush 43 violated the Constitution and how our current leader Barrack Obama violates the Constitution and the people remain quiet and ignorant.

What we need is for governments to eliminate all perks for the married. Whose business is it if two people want to commit to each other whatever their gender? Whose business is it if they decide they no longer want to commit to each other. It is certainly not government business. Allowing that moral issues are involved they are best addressed by Jesus and we should let him. Of course that will require that Christians do something other than protest.

Music Debate

Tom Alexander:

Reference the July 2010 issue of Gospel Advocate, "Music Debate."

While I like your article may I make a comment or two . . or three?

Charley Brown was shooting arrows and then drawing a circle around each arrow. Lucy asked him why he was doing that and Charley replied "this way I never miss."

Many times we do that to prove our positions. To use anyone other than the bible to support out point indicates we do not believe the prophets, apostles, etc are sufficient. Because someone in the second or third century did or did not do something does not provide evidence to support our position. The bible is enough or it is not. If it is not then anything goes.

Nowhere in the New Testament did anyone, including Jesus, tell the "good people" to separate themselves from the "bad people." You can reference Paul's letters as well as Jesus' instructions to the churches in Asia. I understand that to mean that nothing anyone else in the assembly does affects badly on me. Considering Jesus' instructions that our loving each other will show the world we are his disciples may suggest that splitting a congregation over any issue just may be the worst thing that can be done and that all sides are at fault and need to seek forgiveness.

Last, you base your position on the fact that our assemblies are for worship. Where do you find bible support for that view? Paul told the church at Rome that worship was when they presented their individual body as a living sacrifice. The author of Hebrews says our assemblies are for the purpose of encouraging each other to love and good works. I have asked many preachers and authors this question and I have never received a response. I take that to mean they consider my question so ridiculous it does not deserve an answer or most likely that they have no clue and that is their story and they are sticking to it.

For me I do not favor instruments in the assembly because I cannot find it in the Bible. Not that it is wrong just that I cannot find it. And once you get outside of the Bible anything goes. Anyone who wants instruments will hit a wall someplace. They like a piano but do not like drums; they like individual instruments but not bands and orchestras; everyone has a line in the sand and mine is the Bible.

Did the people immersed on Pentecost sign up to convert the world? Were they told on Pentecost if they did not they were going to Hell and having been immersed would not save them from that fate? I do not believe that to be the case so neither do we have that responsibility today. The church is nothing more and nothing less than a group of people who have been immersed and had their sins forgiven. Something no other group can claim. If we would live as if that were true others would see it and want what we have. As it is most live so close to the line that neither their brothers and sisters nor the world can see a separation. Our responsibility as a group is to encourage each other to love and to do good works; to follow Jesus' example, instructions and commands. We have made things much more complicated than they need to be.

I liked your article but I suggest it does not convince anyone who does not already agree with you.

This note is much too long so I will close. If you are still reading this I thank you for your time. If you care to explain how singing to each other, praying for ourselves, contributing primarily for our own comfort, listening to a speaker is worship I will be interested in your thoughts. We have memorial services all of the time for our friends and do not consider that worship so calling the Lord's Supper worship is a stretch.

I am John Jenkins. I am retired. My wife and I live in Gatlinburg and meet with Great Smoky Mountains Church of Christ in Pigeon Forge. Most of whom will agree 100% with your article.

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179 cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

Some people are like a Slinky ... Not really good for anything, but you
still can't help but smile when you shove them down the stairs.

What Would Paul Do?

Recently I was reading an article "Is Your Religion Enough?"  The author writes:

There is plenty of religion and the assortment is nearly unlimited so take your pick. But wait a minute, what is religion all about anyway?

The business of religion can be very confusing unless we can sort out the real issues. What are the issues? The greatest issue is sin.

He later writes

Is your religion providing the power for you to be able to overcome temptation? Does your religion enable you to live a pure life in an immoral society? Has your religion separated you from your former evil habits, friends, and the world? Do you call that sin which the Bible calls sin?  Has your religion brought you into obedience to the Bible?

The author suggests that if our answers to those questions are not an honest "Yes" is our religion enough.

Considering some recent events at PF it appears our newer members were not separating themselves from their old friends or their old habits.

Yesterday while passing the communion trays I was underwhelmed by the clothing of many of the girls in that ministry trip group. Their shorts were extremely short at least while they were sitting. Considering the amount of cleavage and legs on display during the service on the usual Sunday I wonder if Paul would have warned them they are walking too close to the line. Or do you suppose he would have waited until they were pregnant and told them they should have been more careful.

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com 
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

Some people are like a Slinky ... Not really good for anything, but you
still can't help but smile when you shove them down the stairs.

Freedom of Religion

We do not need to do anything today that the first Christians did not do to "go about preaching the gospel." Our lackadaisical attitude in the assembly. Sitting and listening does not promote evangelism. Playing at "worship" does not promote evangelism. Meeting to provoke one another to love and good works does promote evangelism. Those first Christians met to encourage each other not to go to practice a litany of liturgy.

Results

The Psalms has many places where David thanked God for answering his prayers. I cannot find an example of the results of such a prayer. David was afraid of Saul, he ran, he hid. What example can we find where one of David's prayers was answered. Similar to our prayers. We say we believe in prayer and that prayer "works." What example can we find where one of our prayers (public) produced results? The basis for the question is Muslims pray, what results does it produce? Methodists pray, what results does it produce. Are we deluding ourselves or are we erroneously praying? If the prayer of a righteous man "availeth" much does it mean I have never met a righteous man? I find it intriguing that for over 40 years I have never seen an example of a public prayer producing results. Apparently God can handle the flu and a broken leg or wrist but history indicates cancer or other serious illnesses get the best of him every time. He can even find a parking spot but when it comes to the more serious problems his batting average is -0-. I wonder why. No one questions just continues. Are we deluding ourselves?

Faith is a Risk---Whatever You Believe / Ben Carson, MD

Faith is a Risk---Whatever You Believe

Ben Carson, MD

Where did the first living cell come from? Darwin built his entire theory of evolution on the premise that the cell is the simplest, foundational building block of life.

The electron microscope and countless other contemporary tools have only begun to show us how incredibly complex a cell truly is. You have a cell membrane with lipoproteins phasically interposed with positive and negative charges that can allow certain types of molecules to pass through or not, a very complex nucleus and nucleolus, endoplasmic reticulum with ribosomes on it that are able to understand and replicate genetic patterns, and Golgi apparatuses that generate energy. We haven't even begun to discuss genes, the intricate communication patterns of DNA, or any number of additional subcellular ingredients and their functions. If cells are the original starting point of life, how did all of those complex interrelated parts and processes come to be?

But let's just concede that somehow, mysteriously, the first cell about. Where did the great diversity of other cells come from? Darwinism holds that all life evolved in a gradual, progressive, step-by-step process from the simple to the complex. So how did the earlier, simpler single cells all get together to form more complex multi celled organism?

Consider a single eye. How did a rod cell just sit there for millions and millions of years until a cone cell could develop? Then how did multiple rods and cones come together into an intricate visual-sensory apparatus, embedded into the retina as part of a complex neurovascular network, which converts images into electrical information to be passed through the neural network along the optic nerve and reinterpreted in the occipital cortex of the brain as a recognizable image? Even before we get to the retina, what about the pupil? Where and how did it develop in isolation---because there would be no purpose for it without those other things? Nor would there be any purpose for the iris without the pupil and the anterior chamber. There would be no purpose for the cornea, no purpose for the short ciliary nerves, no purpose for any of it without all the other stuff.

Did each type of cell develop on its own and then sit around and wait for a couple of billion years in the hope that some perfectly compatible cell type might come along to finally make it not merely relevant but indispensable as part of an elaborate system that itself complements even more complex systems that are in turn part of the larger organism? How does that jibe with the "survival of the fittest" premise, in which function is a key factor in deciding what genetically useful characteristics are passed on and ultimately which organisms last another generation? Are we then to believe that specialized cells survived for millions of years, fit for no real purpose, until other specialized and completely worthless and unfit cells came along, which also survived for untold eons, to one day combine with them in anticipation of filling some future need that would take millions of more generations and evolutionary steps?

Believing that the origin of life can be explained by Darwinian evolution requires more faith than I have. Evolution and creationism both require faith. It's just a matter of where you choose to place that faith.

Finding God Apart From Church

Charlie Brown was shooting arrows and then drawing a circle around the arrow. Lucy asked him what he was doing. Charlie said this way I never miss. We do the same thing when we are attempting to prove a point. We claim a prayer has been answered when there is no Bible support for the prayer we had prayed. We find a few things a person said we agree with and ignore what he says we do not agree with.

Many young adults are not intentionally avoiding the "church" they are unable to find it. Jesus said the world will know we are his disciples by our love. Over the years Christians have become blind to the reality that many congregations of the Church of Christ are unloving, non-evangelistic, elitist and cold to outsiders.

Like our friends in those many denominations we have formalized our assemblies. We are known for what we are against. Relative to everything but religion we say "united we stand divided we fall." The church of Christ very much refuses to unite with anyone even itself. If another congregation does the slightest thing with which they disagree they cross them off our list of the saved.

If congregations of the Church of Christ expect to attract we must be attractive. Groups attract people like themselves. Gray heads are not going to attract many under 30. Congregations with a majority under 40 are not going to attract many over 60. Unloving and uncaring congregations are not going to attract people who love and care.

While the world goes into eternity without hope the church of Christ prefers to argue if women should make announcements, or pass communion trays etc. If not for our format of sit and listen they argument would be moot. In an assembly in a house a woman standing up and handing a man a communion tray would go unnoticed. A woman telling the group about a sick friend would not be considered making announcements.

The church of Christ of the past 100 or so years is in serious trouble.

The Loving Approach to Evangelism

When Paul was evangelizing Jews he preached from the Jewish Scriptures (Acts 17:2).  When he was evangelizing Gentiles he did not make his case on what he as a Jew believed he made his case on the basis of what his Gentile audience believed.

In Acts 17 while discussing Christ "in the marketplace" Paul encountered some Stoic  and Epicurean philosophers who took him to the Areopagus to share his views with fellow philosophers (19). Paul began his speech not by "confronting their sin"  but by commending them for being "extremely religious." He based his commendation on the fact that these people had so many idolatrous objects of worship (22-23). If he had been talking with Jewish philosophers  his approach may have differed because Jews were expected to know and honor the Old Testament's prohibition on idols. But these were Gentiles so holding them accountable for things they didn't themselves believe would have been unwise, arrogant and rude. Though their idols offended Paul as a Jew (16) he complimented them for their sincerity.

Paul then noted that one of their "objects of … worship" contained the inscription, "To an unknown God." This acknowledged ignorance on their part provided Paul with an opening to present the Gospel. "What … you worship as unknown" Paul said "this I proclaim to you."  Rather than shooting at what one believes is wrong in another's life or way of thinking love looks for the best, looks for truth and then builds on it.  The loving approach to evangelism finds an area of expressed need, uncertainty, or longing and then seeks to meet it as Christ would.

When Paul presents the gospel to these people he doesn't do so on the basis of Scripture as he did earlier with Jews (1-2). Rather he quotes pagan philosophers (28) for these are the sources that have credibility to these folks, not Scripture. Paul builds his case on truths he finds in what the Epicureans and Stoics already believe. He presents Christ as the fulfillment of their own beliefs and the goal of the innate longing God has placed in all people at all times (26-27). While some "scoffed" at his claims others were intrigued enough to want to consider it further (32).

When evangelizing people who do not share one's own presuppositions this is the wise approach to take. Unfortunately Christians who take the "one nation under God" mindset too seriously are lulled into thinking that Americans generally share their presuppositions.  Being duped by the quasi-Christian civil religion, they treat average American citizens almost as if they were Christians who simply weren't living up to their calling. They think they are doing the people a favor by holding them accountable to things that are foreign to them.

Instead of respecting the integrity of people's beliefs, building on what is true about them we simply point out what we think is wrong. Rather than looking for the best, believing the best, and hoping for the best, we zero in on what we believe is the worst. Rather than serving people by taking the time to understand their worldview from the inside and looking for an opening within this worldview we assume they think like us and speak to them from within our own worldview. We unwittingly undermine the credibility of the gospel and do not communicate the central thing we are called to communicate God's love.

People who are shaped by the civil religion of America are no closer to the kingdom of God than people shaped by the civil religion of Buddhism, Islam, or Hinduism, It's nothing more that the civil religious veneer of the culture.  Our job is to serve our fellow Americans by building bridges that connect us with them and entering into their unique worldview jut as Paul did with his Gentile audience.

 

 

 

Re: Reference May 2010 Gospel Advocate “Defining Spirituality in the 1st Century.”

Reference May 2010 Gospel Advocate "Defining Spirituality in the 1^st Century."

 

Nice article. I have a question/comment. When discussing the Old Law I never hear this discussion. My question is am I missing something?

 

Paul wrote: Romans 2:12-16 "For all who have sinned without the law will also perish without the law, and all who have sinned under the law will be judged by the law; for it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law who will be justified. For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus."

 

In the beginning, God had a special relationship with His creation where He spoke directly to heads of households. Eventually he selected Abraham through his son Isaac to begin the people through which Messiah would come. At that time there were two lines. Abraham through Isaac was one line (Jews) everyone else were the other (Gentiles).  

 

The Law of Moses was intended specifically for the Jews; to guide them to the point in time, the fullness of time, when Messiah would come. Everyone else (Gentiles) did not have the law but when by nature they did what the law required (moral aspects) became a law unto themselves allowing them to be acceptable to God and saved as were obedient Jews. When Paul talks about the Old Law being a schoolmaster he was referring to himself and other Jews not Gentiles.

 

On Pentecost, Peter announced the Good News of Jesus to the Jews, requiring the Jews to come to Jesus. The Law of Moses was intended to provide a way for Messiah to be born. Messiah being born removed any necessity for the Jews to be treated special by God. But the Law was not fulfilled until Jesus died, arose, and ascended. Stopping at any time prior to Jesus' return to the Father would have meant no Messiah and mankind would have been left in their sin. Meanwhile the Gentiles continued as they were being acceptable to God when they did by nature things of the Law. Cornelius as well as others were among that number. In Acts chapter 10 we have the accounting how God opened the kingdom of God to Gentiles. "At Caesarea there was a man named Cornelius, a centurion of what was known as the Italian Cohort, a devout man who feared God with all his household, gave alms generously to the people, and prayed continually to God." At this point the two lines, the descendants of Abraham through Isaac as well as the Gentiles were together in Jesus. Acts 10:1,2

 

May 2010, Gospel Advocate “Spiritual but not Religious.”

Justin Rogers:

 

Reference May 2010, Gospel Advocate "Spiritual but not Religious."

 

Interesting article. I try to look behind the response. An example is when you ask a child a question and they say "don't know." They know the answer but they have found that if they answer the question another question will follow. If they don't know the questions stop.  So the answer "don't know" does not mean they lack the knowledge they just are not interested in continuing this discussion.

 

I believe when the answer is Spiritual but Not Religious it means the assembly where you mostly sit and listen is not acceptable. Young people want to do something. They want to experience what it feels like to help someone, to teach someone.

 

Worship is serving others. Worship is not singing to each other, not praying for ourselves, not contributing for our own comfort but serving others. As Jesus did, as Jesus would do today.

 

My experience has been that the only reason one is removed from the "prayer list" is when they die. Why do our denominational friends believe God heals and answers prayers while my experience is he does not? For 45 years I have never seen anyone come off a prayer list because a serious illness was cured. Apparently God can handle a slight fever but has problems curing cancers.

 

Charlie Brown was shooting his bow and arrow. When he shot an arrow he would go up and draw a circle around it. Lucy asked him why he was doing that. Charlie said, "This way I never miss." We do that with prayer and Gods' response to prayer. Young adults don't want to settle for that. The Bible says the prayer of a righteous man avails much. My experience apparently has been to never know a righteous man because I have never seen where prayer does much good. But we continue to draw our circles.

 

Worship is not singing to each other, praying for ourselves, contributing for our own comfort, listening to an entertaining speech. We have memorial services all the time for friends who have died so calling the Lord's Supper worship is a stretch.

 

Young people do not want to settle for what we have settled for. Sit and listen is not acceptable to them. Spiritual but not religious does not necessarily mean separation but change. Change means inactivity to activity.

 

But as before, interesting article.

 

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com  
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

You are getting old when you just can't stand people who are intolerant.

Children and Sex

On the subject of children and sex this is a one discussion I never hear.

Throughout most of the 19th century, the minimum age of consent for sexual intercourse in many of the states was 10 years old. In Delaware it was seven; as late as 1930 twelve states allowed boys as young as 14 and girls as young as 12 to marry with parental consent.

Our laws say a girl under the age of 16 cannot consent to sex but if she becomes pregnant she can consent to aborting her parents' grandchild.

The transition between childhood and adulthood is much longer today than it was less than one hundred years ago. By the time a boy was a seasoned seventeen or eighteen, he was ready to start his own family. A girl became a woman by the time she reached childbearing age; twelve, thirteen, fourteen or fifteen and was often considered old enough to marry. The transition from childhood to adulthood was so short that adolescence---at least as the distinct stage of life we now consider it---hardly existed.

Today the traditional determinations of adulthood---the establishment of occupation and family---are routinely postponed until after college. With the period of childhood innocence seeming shorter and shorter, we've created a new ten-or-twelve-or-more-years-long designation, a no-man's land (or no-woman's land) we term adolescence.

We have stretched adolescence further than any time in history. We are fighting, nature and hormones. We are not going to win so what are we going to do?

Sunday school

Growing an adult Bible study class is not easy, but there are some simple steps to help grow class attendance:

• Make your lesson active not passive, focus on one or two questions per lesson. Make it a question that really doesn't have wrong answers.
• Find people to take care of the needs of each class member. Care group leaders take care of five or six people. The care group leader will call each person each week to encourage them to come to class or to find out why they haven't been coming to class.
• Grow from within. Class members invite others to our class.

Use of the Church Treasury

The example for what we do concerning giving (what we call worship) was for the poor saints in Jerusalem. We have changed that to using the funds mostly for our own benefit. Helping the poor appears to not be an option whether they be in or out of the called out. Preachers, buildings, secretaries, church supplies, pews etc are not addressed in the bible making them non biblical. Not wrong, just not biblical. Being not biblical means we can do whatever we like. Our (worship) contribution should go to helping the poor.That's what the purpose was for the collection we use as an example. The purpose for a Sunday collection then was for convenience which has been made law. Does someone see Pharisee?

All members of an organization should be willing to support the activities of that organization. When the leadership decides on an activity it is a reasonable expectation the members of that group will support the activities. That is reason enough to keep the membership informed and involved. Of course the organization has or at least most organizations have a limit to their funds and that limits what the organization can do.

How Much?

I've suggested before that the Bible appears to promote a communal style of living more than a capitalism life style. If I remember correctly you disagreed.  When we look at examples in Acts of how the early church functioned,  see verses below, you cannot say we operate as they did. Being willing to help is not the same level  of sharing as we read about in Acts. How much can we hold back and still have all things in common?

Acts 2:44-45   

    And all who believed were together and had all things in common.  And they were selling their possessions and belongings and distributing the proceeds to all, as any had need. 

Acts 4:32   

    Now the full number of those who believed were of one heart and soul, and no one said that any of the things that belonged to him was his own, but they had everything in common. 

 

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com  
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

You are getting old when you just can't stand people who are intolerant.

How Do We Know

Matthew tells a story of a man coming to Jesus and asking what he had to do to have eternal life. Jesus' response was to keep the Law. When the man said he did that Jesus told him he should sell what he had, give the money to the poor and come follow Jesus. In the story of the prodigal son the youngest son asked for his share of the inheritance. His father gave him the share which was 2/3rds of the value of the estate. Must have not put the father into the poor house because he continued to have servants etc. So when Jesus told the man to sell what he had and give to the poor I think it reasonable to understand it did not mean a totality of his possessions.

Luke tells the story of the farmer who had so much harvest he built bigger barns instead of sharing. How do those compare with us today investing our money instead of sharing it?

Jesus told his disciples, which today are us, to not be anxious about their life, what they will eat, nor about their  body, what they would put on.  We discount that and say that Jesus does not want us to be poor. Who would pay the preacher or pay for the building if no one had any money?

Jesus also said whomever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 

How do we know when Jesus means what he says and does not mean what he says?

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com  
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

You are getting old when you just can't stand people who are intolerant.

When we use common English in place of church words some concepts are easier to comprehend.

• Saved by Grace turns out to be saved by the kindness of God. 
• Saved by Faith is saved by the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen. 
• Preach the Gospel is preach the Good News. 
• Baptism of the Holy Spirit is immersed by or in the Holy Spirit. 
• Confessing Jesus before man is acknowledging Jesus before man.  

Maybe we do not understand the Bible because we prefer to speak a different language than that of the Bible.

Church Growth Should Be Outside In

While there are nearly 100 million unchurched people in the U.S, more than 80% of the current growth registered by Protestant churches is biological or transfer growth. If the gospel really is good news, then why do most Christians avoid evangelism? 

Christ Like

When I hear the United States is or was a Christian nation I wonder which of our actions mimicked Christ. Was it our invasion of Iraq to save Kuwait from being conquered by their neighbor or was it our doing nothing while genocide occurred in Rwanda and Sudan? Could it have been our practice of slavery or possibly segration of the races?

Worship is Serving

John tells us:

 

John 13:3

    Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he had come from God and was going back to God, 

 

What did Jesus do with this divine authority? Again, John tells us,

 

John 13:4-5

    (Jesus) rose from supper. He laid aside his outer garments, and taking a towel, tied it around his waist. Then he poured water into a basin and began to wash the disciples' feet and to wipe them with the towel that was wrapped around him. 

 

Possessing all power in heaven and earth and knowing he is about to be betrayed and die a horrible death---and what does Jesus do? He assumes the position of a common household servant and washes the disciples' dirty, smelly feet---the very people he knows will betray and forsake him before morning!

 

This is what it means to follow Jesus. If you have all power in heaven and earth, use it to wash the feet of someone you know will betray you!  

 

Several hours later the same power was manifested in the Garden of Gethsemane. As temple guards were about to arrest Jesus, Peter drew his sword and cut off the ear of Malchus, the slave of the high priest (John 18:10).

 

The world perpetuates violence but Jesus did not come to continue that. So, again, far from using his divine authority to fight back, calling legions of angels and forcefully controlling his enemy's behavior, Jesus used his divine authority to heal the ear of a man who came to arrest him. Jesus example is one of unconditional love by serving him, by healing him. Jesus was saying, "though you seek to do me harm I will serve you and heal you." Insofar as we trust this kind of power and think and act accordingly, we are bearers of the kingdom of God. Insofar as we do not we are simply participants in the kingdom of the world.

 

Paul wrote to the church in Rome,

 

Romans 12:1  

    I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship (service). 

 

If we want to show homage to Jesus, to God, we practice servant leadership. We follow Jesus' example

John 14:9  

    Jesus said to him, "… Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. …? 

 

and obey his commands.

 

Worship is serving others. Worship is not singing to each other, not praying for ourselves, not contributing for our own comfort but serving others. As Jesus did, as Jesus would do today.

 

 

 

 

 

Re: Shock on NBC this morning

People who believe America is "one nation under God" may be inclined to view government as the handmaiden of God and inclined to rely on it to carry out the work God has called the church to carry out. More specifically, as with most other Americans, many Christians assume it's the church's job to take care of people's spiritual needs and the government's job to take care of people's physical needs. We preach the gospel while government is supposed to care for the poor, the homeless, the oppressed, the disabled, or the sick. Many deny they believe this but based on how the church acts which is always a better indication of true belief than profession the point is undeniable. With some exceptions, the Church of Christ as a whole is not known for its willingness to assume responsibility for these areas. I believe it fair to suggest this is due to the fact that we trust government to carry out these duties.

It is good for government to take care of people's physical needs but it is not a good thing for Christians to rely on government to carry out this function and thus limit themselves to ministering to people's spiritual needs.

Many Americans turn to the Old Testament more than the New Testament in their understanding of America and of the role of the church within America. They turn to models of Old Testament "watchmen" as in Ezekiel and of John the Baptist to understand what they are supposed to be doing in the culture instead of to the model of Jesus. Instead of living to sacrifice for others, we become the official "sin-pointer-outers." Instead of gaining a reputation of being humble servants who manifest Jesus-quality love, we gain a reputation for being moralistic and self-righteous. Thus as the Pharisees did,we drive off the prostitutes and tax-collectors rather than attracting them, as Jesus did.

There is no biblical basis for separating a person's physical needs from their spiritual ones.

Since Jesus did not fight to maintain Israel's place as God's people we cannot presume he has switched his favoritism to the United States.

Intellectually understanding versus Application

Recently in several classes we have discussed "not judging others."  We are told we will be judged with the same mercy we judge others. Since we will be judged with the same mercy we judge our judging must have some affect on the judged.

 

When Jesus had John write to those seven churches, he did not instruct or even encourage the "obedient" to leave the "disobedient?" In his letter to the Romans, Paul wrote: "Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand." James wrote: "There is only one lawgiver and judge, he who is able to save and to destroy. But who are you to judge your neighbor?" In each case the intended audience was people who had been immersed for the remission of their sins.

 

The non-instrumental division of the Church of Christ has many divisions that refuse to associate with each other. By refusing to assemble with other divisions isn't one division showing they think the other(s) are wrong and therefore "lost." When one group of people immersed for the forgiveness of their sins refuses to assemble with another group or people immersed for the forgiveness of their sins aren't they judging them?

 

What is the judging we are not to do?

 

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com  
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

"Telling shoeless people to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps is not only cruel, it's also pointless."
Martin Luther King

At What Point are we Allowed to Not Love but to Judge

Jesus told his disciples they were to love each other. Considering the individual continued to follow Jesus, at what point could he have done something that would permit the others to stop loving him?

 

When Jesus had John write to those seven churches, he did not instruct or even encourage the "obedient" to leave the "disobedient?"

 

Jesus told the people they should not judge others. In his letter to the Romans, Paul wrote: "Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand." James wrote: "There is only one lawgiver and judge, he who is able to save and to destroy. But who are you to judge your neighbor?"

 

At what point are we allowed to condemn others to Hell and therefore refuse to associate with them?

Nehemiah's Prayer

The words of Nehemiah the son of Hacaliah.

 

"O LORD God of heaven, the great and awesome God who keeps covenant and steadfast love with those who love him and keep his commandments, let your ear be attentive and your eyes open, to hear the prayer of your servant that I now pray before you day and night for the people of Israel your servants, confessing the sins of the people of Israel, which we have sinned against you. Even I and my father's house have sinned. We have acted very corruptly against you and have not kept the commandments, the statutes, and the rules that you commanded your servant Moses. Remember the word that you commanded your servant Moses, saying, 'If you are unfaithful, I will scatter you among the peoples, but if you return to me and keep my commandments and do them, though your dispersed be under the farthest skies, I will gather them from there and bring them to the place that I have chosen, to make my name dwell there.' They are your servants and your people, whom you have redeemed by your great power and by your strong hand. O Lord, let your ear be attentive to the prayer of your servant, and to the prayer of your servants who delight to fear your name, and give success to your servant today, and grant him mercy in the sight of this man."

 

Ezra's Prayer

Last night we discussed Ezra's prayer. Sometimes when you take the verse numbers out and let the continuity flow the result is interesting.

 

At that time those who had come from captivity, the returned exiles, offered burnt offerings to the God of Israel, twelve bulls for all Israel, ninety-six rams, seventy-seven lambs, and as a sin offering twelve male goats. All this was a burnt offering to the LORD. They also delivered the king's commissions to the king's satraps and to the governors of the province Beyond the River, and they aided the people and the house of God.

 

After these things had been done, the officials approached me and said,

 

"The people of Israel and the priests and the Levites have not separated themselves from the peoples of the lands with their abominations, from the Canaanites, the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Jebusites, the Ammonites, the Moabites, the Egyptians, and the Amorites. For they have taken some of their daughters to be wives for themselves and for their sons, so that the holy race has mixed itself with the peoples of the lands. And in this faithlessness the hand of the officials and chief men has been foremost."

 

As soon as I heard this, I tore my garment and my cloak and pulled hair from my head and beard and sat appalled. Then all who trembled at the words of the God of Israel, because of the faithlessness of the returned exiles, gathered around me while I sat appalled until the evening sacrifice. And at the evening sacrifice I rose from my fasting, with my garment and my cloak torn, and fell upon my knees and spread out my hands to the LORD my God, saying:

 

"O my God, I am ashamed and blush to lift my face to you, my God, for our iniquities have risen higher than our heads, and our guilt has mounted up to the heavens. From the days of our fathers to this day we have been in great guilt. And for our iniquities we, our kings, and our priests have been given into the hand of the kings of the lands, to the sword, to captivity, to plundering, and to utter shame, as it is today. But now for a brief moment favor has been shown by the LORD our God, to leave us a remnant and to give us a secure hold within his holy place that our God may brighten our eyes and grant us a little reviving in our slavery, for we are slaves. Yet our God has not forsaken us in our slavery, but has extended to us his steadfast love before the kings of Persia, to grant us some reviving to set up the house of our God, to repair its ruins, and to give us protection in Judea and Jerusalem.

 

And now, O our God, what shall we say after this? For we have forsaken your commandments, which you commanded by your servants the prophets, saying, 'The land that you are entering, to take possession of it, is a land impure with the impurity of the peoples of the lands, with their abominations that have filled it from end to end with their uncleanness. Therefore do not give your daughters to their sons, neither take their daughters for your sons, and never seek their peace or prosperity, that you may be strong and eat the good of the land and leave it for an inheritance to your children forever.' And after all that has come upon us for our evil deeds and for our great guilt, seeing that you, our God, have punished us less than our iniquities deserved and have given us such a remnant as this, shall we break your commandments again and intermarry with the peoples who practice these abominations? Would you not be angry with us until you consumed us, so that there should be no remnant, nor any to escape? O LORD the God of Israel, you are just, for we are left a remnant that has escaped, as it is today. Behold, we are before you in our guilt, for none can stand before you because of this."

 

While Ezra prayed and made confession, weeping and casting himself down before the house of God, a very great assembly of men, women, and children, gathered to him out of Israel, for the people wept bitterly. 

 

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com  
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

"Telling shoeless people to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps is not only cruel, it's also pointless."
Martin Luther King

Facebook and the Church

Part of the issue has been created by our lazy speech. Immersion does not make one a Christian. A Christian is one who follows Jesus. Following Jesus requires obeying his Commands. According to the author of Hebrews following Jesus includes assembling with others who have been immersed and encouraging them to love and good works.  Obeying Jesus' commands requires one to read and to study the Bible to know his commands. Anyone who has not been immersed as shown in examples in the Book of the Acts of the Apostles and does not assemble with fellow believers is not Christian. Facebook will have no affect on Christians but it will give an out to pretenders.

Prayer in Public Places

Prayer is not a weapon nor is it a demonstration of one's piety, nor is it competition; it is communication with God. And God said:

"But when you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you." Matthew 6:6

The only thing a Christian should bring to their job are honesty, ethics, morality. Specifically what is expected to come from saying the "Lord's Prayer?"

 

Loaning our Building

Concerning playing a CD or DVD or MP3 etc with instrumental music as apparently happened during the recent Ladies get together in our building:

 

While I do not advocate the use of instruments during our assemblies it is not because I believe it to be wrong but because I cannot find it in the New Testament. I am convinced introducing anything not found in the Bible especially if it causes a division is wrong and just might be the greatest wrong.

 

I understood someone from our congregation was going to be present during the activities. For future reference should they be authorized to stop unwanted behavior? Should the requesting congregation be told we will stop any activity we consider sinful? Is someone going to add to the rules on the Building Use form? Will those Ladies be permitted to use if they submit a request? It will happen again.

 

If they are not permitted to play an instrumental DVD or CD along with their singing because the activity is considered worship and one of our men is present can those women make announcements or lead prayers? Or do we take the position many take that allowing a congregation to use our building does not suggest we agree with everything they will be doing?

 

Does He or Doesn't He

Hi Al,

 

Am I the only one who sees us as a bit inconsistent? We say God puts opportunities in our path but then we have discussions such as yesterday concerning how to determine if God put the opportunity in our path or Satan or maybe it just popped up. In the past I said it would be a long time before GSMCOC walked by faith. Not being knowledgeable of the finances I am not sure but from the general tone of the discussion we may be getting close to, as they say, putt our money where our mouth is. The men obviously have never been in a situation where they were told they have -0-. Recently Gary Dick and I came in contact with a man in the parking lot ( I forget why it was just he and I) with the typical sob story. We both gave him something. God either gives us opportunities or he does not. God will either help us to be discerning or he will not. Might be worthwhile to decide what we believe. No one responded to Richard Sortore's question concerning Grace. When everything is in sight it is easy to walk by faith. 

 

Thanks, John Jenkins
865-803-8179  cell
Gatlinburg, TN

Email: jrjenki@gmail.com
Website: http://www.greenbriersolutions.com  
Blog: http://littlepigeon.blogspot.com/

"Telling shoeless people to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps is not only cruel, it's also pointless."
Martin Luther King